"I'm a conservative in terms of games I like. Not now, and not when he first started gaming. Grey was first drawn to roguelikes because he never had any interest in twitchy, input-heavy games. He made a point that forced me to consider how the emerging mainstream interpretation of the genre might be more incongruous with the original text than us normies fully understand. That point is echoed by Darren Grey, another moderator of the r/roguelike subreddit who also hosts the Roguelike Radio podcast (opens in new tab). "That's part of what got us here in the first place, that there is no one clear definition of what a roguelike is, so it's naturally evolving over time based on its use by different parties, and the speed of that evolution has accelerated considerably in the last five years!" "We had a perfectly fine term for this genre for a couple decades and there is a certain loss of identity when a mainstream majority starts using that term to mean something rather different and we can no longer use it to have the same meaning it once had, at least not without considering the audience," says Ge. Instead, as the rest of the world catches on with roguelikes that don't fit the original criteria-as Hades racks up Game of the Year awards-this issue becomes about identity. It's not so much about dogma or one-upmanship, he explains. But clearly, says Ge, this is a topic that cuts deep. (Check out this article he published last year, where he wrestles with that monolithic question, " What is a traditional roguelike? (opens in new tab)") Ge has grown exhausted of the chronic metaphysical flame wars, and tells me that the moderation team on the forum essentially banned discussions on the "nature of roguelikes" earlier this year. He is a self-avowed, but goodhearted member of the old guard, and has graciously waded into the roguelike demarcation debates in the past. Josh Ge, a roguelike developer and one of the moderators of both r/roguelike and r/roguelikedev, responded to my email. there is no one clear definition of what a roguelike is, so it's naturally evolving over time Josh Ge What do they think they're losing as roguelikes stray further from their stringent origins? Why is genre sanctity worth defending to the death? There was something spiritual here that I never encountered in my monthly dose of Hearthstone grousing. The passion for the purity of the genre transcended the grievances I became accustomed to in my communities of choice. But I've always wanted to hear the roguelike lifers out. Look, gamers are pedantic, and it's pretty easy to get annoyed by pickled, gatekeeping attitudes in any community. They are screamed at, called names, told to leave, and they usually do." Every confused comment from the OP makes things worse and they are downvoted into oblivion. "This poor soul, not having the first fucking clue about the decade long debate over the word roguelike, innocently shares their love and asks for recommendations", writes Reid. A bright-eyed gamer wanders into the forum, and sparks a discussion about whatever False Roguelike they're currently enjoying, like Darkest Dungeon or Rogue Legacy, only to get shouted down by the dedicated posters. Jeremiah Reid, the creator of the gothic roguelike Golden Krone Hotel, parodied a recurring interaction he witnessed on r/roguelike in his blog (opens in new tab). (In the past, the term used for those games was the even more cumbersome, "Roguelikelike.") "Roguelites," they say, include meta-progression and real-time combat a la Hades, and true roguelikes would never appease the player in that way. Hardcore devotees have gone as far to devise a separate subclassification to keep the genre pure. In fact, at this point, a crucial part of being into roguelikes is to carry on a constant dialogue about what a roguelike is. Low-value factors: ASCII display, dungeons, a single player-character, tactical challenge, rules applying to monsters in the same way as the player, and visible numeric values for player-character stats. High-value factors: random environment generation, permadeath, resource management (such as food and potions), exploration and discovery gameplay that's turn-based, grid-based, hack'n'slash, and non-modal, meaning actions available in combat should be available during any other state (exceptions are made for the overworld in ADOM and shops in Crawl).
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